PROTRACK

A forum devoted to track events from 60m to the 2 mile. Mainly pro but also news from local, national and international sprint & middle distance competitions.

Log in

I forgot my password



Search
 
 

Display results as :
 


Rechercher Advanced Search

October 2017
MonTueWedThuFriSatSun
      1
2345678
9101112131415
16171819202122
23242526272829
3031     

Calendar Calendar


You are not connected. Please login or register

PROTRACK » GENERAL » Gender Balance

Gender Balance

Go to page : Previous  1, 2

View previous topic View next topic Go down  Message [Page 2 of 2]

31 Re: Gender Balance on Mon May 01, 2017 8:43 am

Fast


ProTrack A Grader
ProTrack A Grader
Discobull wrote:i hope your referring to wisil, fast.
i can assure you my athlete who was the backmarker in the final, has supported the val every year, run plenty of races and paid her dues.
To say otherwise would be a blatant lie, and if referring to wisil, pretty sure she has run plenty of pro events in Queensland as well.

If you read my previous posts, Coates was one I was hoping would win and would have also been a great result...a backmarker who supports the league and young too.



Last edited by Fast on Mon May 01, 2017 2:42 pm; edited 1 time in total

32 Re: Gender Balance on Mon May 01, 2017 10:51 am

Hubbaup


Hardly in the Sherlock Holmes category there Hey Hey , anybody who I follow on Insta or in turn follow me for whatever reason should know who Hubbaup is. Also gives me a fair idea who is hiding behind the Hey Hey persona. Anyhow I have absolutely no problem with being identified. Never did I say I didn't want a backmarker winning the Women's Gift. I would not even know what the cut off to be called a Backmarker is. Is it 2m 3m 4m or anybody who finds themselves in a red bib from time to time? Was it great to see Wisil run at Stawell? Yes. Would I have liked to see her win ?Not Really. I know she runs in the Qld Pro League but I would like her to come down to run in a few more in Victoria like  Phillips , Blizzard , Farmer and a few others do. At least an appearance at say Stonnington or Ballarat would suffice. I like Fast,have no problem with Coates winning or finishing as high as she did as she will run at or enter the smaller Victorian Gifts like St Albans Northcote etc. But the VAL need to reward the Week in Week out runner that goes to Ararat Warrnambool Wangaratta and these places and likewise the Ballarat and Bendigo squads that travel to Melbourne every weekend.  The likes of Wisil need to be given every chance to win like she was given, but also in turn she would need to produce her best to get the job done in which she didn't. I'm sure every girl in the Stawell Final produced something near or did produce a RPM PB and they are the ones who deserved to be in that final. I think something like the incentive scheme that's in place for the Men, be introduced into the Women's and that may encourage a little more honest running within the Women's Ranks. But I think if you run at 80 % of the meetings you should be entitled to at least be given the chance at Stawell at your ceiling handicap or very close to it. Nothing worse than than being out of position at Stawell as my kid found out the hard way but I'm sure when she looks in the Ballarat Book in 20 years time and sees her name as the 2017 Winner that will overshadow any of the disappointment of this years Stawell Gift. Anyhow that's how I see it all and hopefully there are some changes in how some things are done. I like a lot of what Fast has put forward in regards to changes to handicapping transparancey procedures and protocol.

33 Re: Gender Balance on Mon May 01, 2017 11:24 am

Keelium


Hey Hey wrote:This post is directed at fast and Mr Henderson (aka hubba)
Having a go at backmarkers or so called once a year runners that you say dont deserve to right to win is ludicrous. These athletes national, state, australia representatives support the val by paying there rego , run when they can, and when not, run track and dont hide there pb's. They dont get the lifts from running each week and work there ass off to improve on the current marks they have. Alot of girls peak at 15 / 16,  Development after that age takes alot of work / a good coach and dedication.
Tell me who deserves the money more (its always going to be the argument)
1. a  pure val runner who runs week in week out pays there money and plays the system by entering events to hide marks.   or
2. A up and coming amateur athlete who is trying to make there living as a full time athlete to make it to the biggest stage,and pay to financially support themselves to make it.  we all know athletics isnt a financially rich sport,

This argument will always a difference of opinion.

These athletes both deserve the opportunity.
Liv did her job, craig did his job,

Did the handicapper and the rules, thats the arguement, and why

Because the sport is driven by $$$$$.  With out it theres is no money from sponsors.
Perception has been that what has happened over the last 3 years is bad for the pro league, maybe it has, if the outside world that only watches this once a year are the ones that are putting the $$$ in then we will be in trouble,
Next year will be the real test after the guarantee $$$ have finished. Just ask Tom while so many early events where cancelled this season, and why didn't we have a main sponsor for the men at stawell, it wasnt through lack of trying.
Lets hope it does not hurt the val.

My Two Cents.


The main difference you're missing between your amateurs and your pro's like Liv is one is running for the money and one is running to have their names written in the history book, the plaque in the street and their name etched on the stone at the hall of fame. You said it yourself, the money means much more to your amateurs to support themselves rather than running for the sash itself.

Mark my words, if that big novelty cheque isn't waiting at the finish line next year, the amount of 'top amateurs' and overall number of girls running down the straight will be much much less.

If you're in it for the cash you've already lost.

I'll be running at Stawell next year if there were five 0's and nothing else on that cheque

~ All about the sash not the cash ~

34 Re: Gender Balance on Mon May 01, 2017 2:03 pm

FortySevenThirty


The difference between Wisil Coates and some of the other Top Amateurs is their goals are different to the Pro girls. I'm sure Dobbyn,O'Dwyer,Martin and Ryan were set for one race and one race only. The Stawell Gift. I read on here a post by Fishbowl who said "Coates may be running at Penn Relays and then at the Bahamas in relays so she maybe wasn't even running Stawell. Obviously that says to me that the Stawell Gift was not her goal and that barring her injury she was off to run relays. Which would have been a fantastic achievement. So it was a mighty effort to run third off a tight mark when realistically it wasn't her main focus. I must admit I didn't see Ryan coming either but girls like Perry Blizzard and Powell were all positioned perfectly for a tilt because that was their Grand Final and only goal for the season. With Commonwealth Games on at the same time next season it will be won again by another girl whose focus is the Gift albeit with a maybe a slightly smaller Cheque. I hope not.

35 Re: Gender Balance on Mon May 01, 2017 2:30 pm

youngy

avatar
Admin
Admin
An interesting fact, and it's coming from the perspective of a handicapper - Toea Wisil ran more 120m women's gifts this season than Liv Ryan did. Wisil's running might have been in SA or Qld, but she did have form over the distance for the handicapper to assess her on.

As a handicapper it is much easier to handicap an athlete for a particular event/distance when that athlete has run in a similar event through the season against her peers. Many of the athletes who ran in the Women's Stawell Gift also ran at the Bay Sheffield, giving the handicapper a very good sight on Wisil's predicament from scratch.

Now I'm not taking anything away form the winner, but when Hubbaup suggests he wouldn't liked to have seen Wisil win because she didn't run in the VAL...well when we're strictly talking about 120m women's gifts, neither did Liv Ryan.

At 16yo and sitting on the limit, the 'Stawell Gift' window of opportunity for Liv Ryan is as wide as the windows on the Rialto Tower. Plenty of years ahead for her to improve and have chance after chance.

For Toea Wisil her window was about as wide as the one Ivan Milat can see out from his prison cell.

Knowing that Liv Ryan is so young and has more chance of winning a second Stawell Gift than Wisil has of winning her first.........I personally would have preferred Wisil to win. Having watched it a few times, I reckon Toea has run better. So she did have her chance but unfortunately she was a metre off her best.

And don't assume that I think Liv Ryan was not a worthy winner - she was certainly that. She stood up when it counted and ran a superb race.

 


_________________
"Let's Go While We're Young"

36 Re: Gender Balance on Mon May 01, 2017 2:45 pm

Hubbaup


I respect your opinion Youngy as their is probably no one more respected in the sport than yourself. But my opinion on this matter is slightly different. I'm sure I wouldn't have lost any sleep if Wisil had of saluted and she would have been a worthy champion but I like to see a runner who runs Week in week out in the VAL get the job done. Just my preference mate. No disrespect to Wisil from my behalf though. Incredible runner.

37 Re: Gender Balance on Mon May 01, 2017 2:54 pm

youngy

avatar
Admin
Admin
Hubbaup wrote:I respect your opinion Youngy as their is probably no one more respected in the sport than yourself. But my opinion on this matter is slightly different. I'm sure I wouldn't have lost any sleep if Wisil had of saluted and she would have been a worthy champion but I like to see a runner who runs Week in week out in the VAL get the job done. Just my preference mate. No disrespect to Wisil from my behalf though. Incredible runner.

Yep, fair call. And if I was in your shoes I'd be saying exactly the same thing. Smile


_________________
"Let's Go While We're Young"

38 Re: Gender Balance on Mon May 01, 2017 2:58 pm

2cents


Hubbaup wrote:I respect your opinion Youngy as their is probably no one more respected in the sport than yourself. But my opinion on this matter is slightly different. I'm sure I wouldn't have lost any sleep if Wisil had of saluted and she would have been a worthy champion but I like to see a runner who runs Week in week out in the VAL get the job done. Just my preference mate. No disrespect to Wisil from my behalf though. Incredible runner.

So basically you have to be a victorian hubbaup. surely you cant expect interstaters to come over more than a few times a year.

I think runners having a crack at Stawell should come over once or twice but you cant expect them to run 'week in week out'

39 Re: Gender Balance on Mon May 01, 2017 5:39 pm

Hubbaup


Yeah 2 cents I'm a Victorian. Just one or two would be enough. Just to support the second tier races. There is a fair few that come down to run a couple during the season or come across and I think that's good for the Sport.

Sponsored content


View previous topic View next topic Back to top  Message [Page 2 of 2]

Go to page : Previous  1, 2

Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum