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PROTRACK » GENERAL » Handicapping of interstate raiders !!

Handicapping of interstate raiders !!

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1 Handicapping of interstate raiders !! on Sun Mar 01, 2015 3:05 pm

Hubbaup


Is it just me or doesn't anybody else agree that we seem to not put enough effort into the handicapping of interstaters. Seems to me that more and more interstaters can just come over for a meeting or two and clean up. And not just win but bolt in. Some quick calculations at Geelong after the first heat of the Vets 100m and boom that was the Vets and Women's shipped off to Queensland, happened at Maryborough with the Sydney Father Son Combo and last year at Stawell with Horne. 5 of the 6 Men's finalists at Stonnington were interstaters and there has probably been a fair few more. Is it sour grapes on my behalf or are they handicapped to run quicker then Victorians. Or do Victorians get looked after the same when they travel interstate. It's becoming expensive to run for second.

2 Re: Handicapping of interstate raiders !! on Sun Mar 01, 2015 7:22 pm

birdman


i must say I think its sour grapes...Victorians come to Adelaide and seem to get looked after because our handicappers seem to think we need to them to run here....maby the sa guys who went to stonnington ran upto form and the vics are just waiting for stawell...I don't think sa runners would think they get a better deal over in victoria

3 Re: Handicapping of interstate raiders !! on Sun Mar 01, 2015 8:00 pm

Matenga


Yeah I can't tell if this is a serious post or a troll post haha. But I think the vast majority would agree that in the VAL the interstaters cop the short straw compared to the locals.

4 Re: Handicapping of interstate raiders !! on Mon Mar 02, 2015 1:07 pm

flashest1


I know of 2 SA lads who were pulled back 3.25 metres (for Don Furness) from their most recent SA 70m marks, whilst most other sprinters were pulled back between 2 & 2.5 metres, needless to say they didn't make the final! Not only do the athletes have costs associated with 'going' interstate but also their coaches would probably travel over as well.

5 Re: Handicapping of interstate raiders !! on Mon Mar 02, 2015 1:58 pm

Hubbaup


It's still very frustrating though JH

6 Re: Handicapping of interstate raiders !! on Mon Mar 02, 2015 3:50 pm

auspro


NEWS FLASH. Get with the times.

Things are going online alot faster these days. Im sure it doesnt take a genius to realise that recording and sharing data and footage is a pretty simple answer that could be put into place TODAY! youngy does a great job broadcasting SA, NSW could easily follow. It is ridiculous that a runner still starts on different marks in different states without justification. Its not hard wind gauge, elec timing and a camera.

7 Re: Handicapping of interstate raiders !! on Mon Mar 02, 2015 4:22 pm

Hubbaup


Totally Agree with Auspro surely it can't be that hard to have it all uniform !!

8 Re: Handicapping of interstate raiders !! on Mon Mar 02, 2015 5:20 pm

youngy

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There are a few isolated incidents of athletes who, in my view, have probably been allocated a tougher than normal mark, however in the main, most interstate athletes have a competitive mark in something.

Recent results indicate that if the athlete is in their best shape such as Dunmall & Jespard, they can win a decent race. Dylan Hicks was extremely unlucky to run into a rampaging Luke Stevens. As was Tjimarri Sanderson-Milera at Stonnington with Dunmall. Innes-Wong ran 2nd at Ballarat, although in hindsight the standard of Ballarat appeared to be down compared to last year. But it was the fastest CIW has ever run, just a tad unlucky.

I think the depth & standard in SA is not as strong as the VAL. So to allocate an SA athlete his SA mark in a VAL event, in some instances, would see the athlete struggle to be competitive. However there are some where that wouldn't apply. 

An SA athlete handicapped less than his SA mark in the VAL would in most cases, render the athlete uncompetitive in Victoria. 


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9 Re: Handicapping of interstate raiders !! on Mon Mar 02, 2015 5:44 pm

auspro


If all states follow the VAL system. Do they receive '3 ticks' and a lift entitlement from races australia wide ? I think the 3 tick system is good but not great. It teachers runners to just play the game. Why not aim for something a little higher than the VAL.

10 Handicapping of interstate raiders !! on Tue Mar 03, 2015 1:27 pm

DarrenW


I can see many benefits to a national administration, but I don't support a national handicapping system. Among other reasons, one of the great benefits of each state handicapping independently is that there is always an alternative if your handicaps in your home state are not competitive. I am certain this has also retained athletes in the sport.

In regard to the recent success of interstate athletes in the VAL, I think it's important to assess each athlete independently. I'd be interested to know if the likes of Eschebach, Hicks, Dunmall, Innes-Wong, Sanderson-Milera, etc. have all improved, run PB's and are starting off tighter marks than they have before. I think they are. Then, it would be interesting to know how many Vics are in PB shape and not competitive...

11 Re: Handicapping of interstate raiders !! on Wed Mar 04, 2015 1:04 pm

auspro


Agree with that darrenW. I think the post is more in regards to the races other than the gifts, where i would say most of the handicapping effert is at. Looking at recent races. I think Eschebach, innes-wong and dunmall either winning or running pb's And all off tightest marks yet back after stawall finals.
Personally i think the handicapping falls down in events where there is more room for improvement in the runners. Such as junior and vets. I mean how easy is for a vet to hobble down the track then suddenly drop the walking stick for a big race. and i would presume 16 and 17 year olds would improve quite a few meters each season..

12 Re: Handicapping of interstate raiders !! on Wed Mar 04, 2015 6:28 pm

Pro Pasto


Hubbaup wrote:Is it just me or doesn't anybody else agree that we seem to not put enough effort into the handicapping of interstaters. Seems to me that more and more interstaters can just come over for a meeting or two and clean up... 5 of the 6 Men's finalists at Stonnington were interstaters and there has probably been a fair few more. Is it sour grapes on my behalf or are they handicapped to run quicker then Victorians. Or do Victorians get looked after the same when they travel interstate. It's becoming expensive to run for second.

I think when someone spends the money, annual leave, effort etc. to travel interstate they intend to ACTUALLY RUN the race, prize money irrelevant. Too much of an investment not to. While this may not completely rebut your statement, it is an interesting argument.

Lets see how many of those local Stonnington non finalists find a metre or two at Stawell.

13 Re: Handicapping of interstate raiders !! on Wed Mar 04, 2015 8:18 pm

Hubbaup


It's a fair point you raise there Pro Pasto and I respect your opinion, time will tell how many runners across the board find a metre or two for Stawell

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