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PROTRACK » GENERAL » PRE-BAY Handicaps

PRE-BAY Handicaps

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1 PRE-BAY Handicaps on Thu Dec 06, 2012 4:43 pm

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http://www.saal.org.au/index.php?id=27

PRE-BAY Colley Reserve
Sunday 9th December 2012


70m Open
1 Jordan Caldow 0.50 m
2 Todd Bateman 2.00 m
3 Clay Watkins 2.75 m
4 Brett Richards 4.50 m
5 Chris Innes-Wong 4.75 m
6 Ben Koschade 4.75 m
7 Tom Sclanders 4.75 m
8 Corey Baker 5.00 m
9 Samuel Gill 5.00 m
10 Dylan Hicks 5.00 m
11 Peter Kipreou 5.00 m
12 Damien Nicholls 5.00 m
13 Tjimarri Sanderson-Milera 5.00 m
14 Lyall Weir 5.25 m
15 James Cibich 5.75 m
16 Josh Dawkins 5.75 m
17 Bradley Jolly 5.75 m
18 Lachlan Sheffield 5.75 m
19 David Gross 6.00 m
20 Adrian Harris 6.00 m
21 Tim Johnson 6.00 m
22 Bradley Letton 6.00 m
23 Valentino Yuel 6.00 m
24 Ryan Hancock 6.25 m
25 Jackson Hoffmann 6.25 m
26 Jarrad Dartnall 6.50 m
27 Cameron Hext 6.50 m
28 Nicholas Giles 6.75 m
29 Trent O'Loughlin 6.75 m
30 Steven Jones 7.00 m
31 Bray Rafanelli 7.00 m
32 Neil Thomas 7.25 m
33 Nickolas Berry 7.50 m
34 David Palmer 7.50 m
35 Luke Buchanan 7.75 m
36 Christopher Simpson 7.75 m
37 Troy Welfare 7.75 m
38 Ben Wright 7.75 m
39 Jason Davis 8.00 m
40 Tyson Hancock 8.00 m
41 Aaron Harrison 8.00 m
42 Nathan Hoare 8.00 m
43 Paul Taylor 8.00 m
44 Daniel Flesfadar 8.25 m
45 Ben Hardy 8.25 m
46 Clint Tobin 8.25 m
47 Shaun Ryder 8.75 m
48 Brad Schutz 8.75 m
49 Simon Thompson 8.75 m
50 Anthony Fedele 9.75 m
51 Ross Nitschke 9.75 m
52 Shane Grimwade 10.00 m
53 Andrew Beck 10.25 m
54 David Girolamo 10.25 m
55 Ali Saliu 10.75 m
56 Brendan Golden 11.75 m
57 Mark Donovan 12.25 m



MORT DALY RUNNING FOUNDATION 70m Women
1 Alicia Wrench-Doody 0.50 m
2 Natasha Wright 1.50 m
3 Courtney Lyas 3.25 m
4 Lauren Foote 4.00 m
5 Andrea Di Paolo 4.50 m
6 Lily Micklethwait 5.00 m
7 Hayley Orman 5.00 m
8 Natalie Gibbs 5.25 m
9 Amie Mittiga 5.50 m
10 Lauren Edwards 5.75 m
11 Katie Devlin 6.00 m
12 Amy Robb 6.00 m
13 Hayley Openshaw 6.25 m
14 Taylah Scapens 7.00 m
15 Makayla Hoffmann 7.25 m
16 Jana Tankosic 7.75 m
17 Natasha Inglis 8.00 m
18 Katie Jury 8.00 m
19 Kate Monks 8.00 m
20 Rachel Fisk 8.25 m
21 Jessica Macolino 8.25 m
22 Margaret Cusenza 8.50 m
23 Sarah Donovan 8.50 m
24 Hettie Driscoll 8.50 m
25 Megan Letton 8.75 m
26 Sarah Ayling 9.00 m
27 Nichola Coombe 9.00 m
28 Hollie Moran 9.00 m
29 Lucy Buckley 9.50 m
30 Georgia Hext 9.50 m
31 Yasmin Openshaw 9.50 m
32 Rommi Driscoll 9.75 m
33 Lesley Tompson 9.75 m
34 Kyla Brown 10.00 m
35 Lauren Kotz 11.50 m
36 Aimee Lane 11.50 m
37 Dominque Edwards 12.50 m
38 Lisa Roberts 12.75 m
39 Lauren McHugh 13.00 m
40 Kim Staporski 13.00 m
41 Anthea Kotyla 14.00 m



MORT DALY RUNNING FOUNDATION 70m Under 17
1 Sebastian Baird 0.00 m
2 Ryan McCarthy 4.00 m
3 Oliver Callahan 5.25 m
4 Lewis Warland 5.75 m
5 Murlin Every 6.00 m
6 Jack Hannah 7.00 m
7 Sam O'Grady 7.00 m
8 Bailey Sadedin 7.00 m
9 Ryan Atkins 7.50 m
10 Lincoln Hill 7.50 m
11 Josh Koster 7.50 m
12 Ryan Russell 7.50 m
13 Zac Gregson 7.75 m
14 Joshua Stangroome 7.75 m
15 Lewis Abdul 8.00 m
16 Liam Rickard 8.00 m
17 Joshua Biggs 8.50 m
18 Bradley Harvey 8.50 m
19 Hayden Mayes 8.50 m
20 Jess Rafanelli 8.50 m
21 Hayden Rothe 8.50 m
22 Ryan Mayes 9.00 m
23 Bailey Turner 9.75 m
24 Lily Micklethwait 10.00 m
25 Lucy Mayo 10.50 m
26 Kyle Roberts 10.75 m
27 Cassidy Dorian 11.00 m
28 Tom O Malley 11.00 m
29 Kirsty Taylor 11.50 m
30 Sarah Chigwidden 12.00 m
31 Emily Young 12.75 m
32 Lachlan Burrows 13.00 m
33 Marshall Harvey 13.00 m
34 Cameron Vinall 13.00 m
35 Kate Monks 13.75 m
36 Madi Blight 14.00 m
37 Mikaela Harmston 14.00 m
38 Hollie Moran 14.00 m
39 Harrison Morgan 14.00 m
40 Katie Jury 14.25 m
41 Sophie Bonner 14.50 m
42 Mikayla Round 14.75 m
43 Taylah Scapens 15.00 m
44 Lily Drummond 15.25 m
45 Jazmin McShane 15.25 m
46 Lachie Moran 15.25 m
47 Emma Jury 15.50 m
48 Makayla Hoffmann 16.00 m
49 Lauren Kotz 16.00 m
50 Bradley Samarcq 16.00 m
51 Margaret Cusenza 16.50 m
52 Madeline Nicholson 16.50 m
53 Jenni Partington 17.00 m



MORT DALY RUNNING FOUNDATION 120m Open
1 Jordan Caldow 0.50 m
2 Clay Watkins 3.25 m
3 Alex Bubner 5.00 m
4 Corey Baker 5.50 m
5 Ben Koschade 5.75 m
6 Tom Sclanders 6.50 m
7 James Cibich 6.75 m
8 Chris Innes-Wong 6.75 m
9 Brett Richards 6.75 m
10 Jarrod Sims 6.75 m
11 Sebastian Baird 7.00 m
12 Peter Kipreou 7.00 m
13 Damien Nicholls 7.00 m
14 Jonathon Sinclair 7.00 m
15 Deng Bulabek 7.50 m
16 Josh Dawkins 7.75 m
17 Connor Verrall 7.75 m
18 Michael Bolton 8.00 m
19 Adrian Harris 8.00 m
20 Lyall Weir 8.25 m
21 Dylan Hicks 8.50 m
22 Tim Johnson 8.50 m
23 Sam Osmond 8.50 m
24 Jarrad Dartnall 8.75 m
25 Adam Coote 9.00 m
26 Cameron Hext 9.00 m
27 Jackson Hoffmann 9.00 m
28 Bradley Letton 9.00 m
29 Liam Wright 9.00 m
30 Ryan Hancock 9.25 m
31 Jake Stangewitz 9.25 m
32 Trent O'Loughlin 9.50 m
33 Nickolas Berry 9.75 m
34 Nicholas Giles 9.75 m
35 David Gross 9.75 m
36 Riordan Welsh 9.75 m
37 Jason Davis 10.00 m
38 Neil Thomas 10.75 m
39 Troy Welfare 11.00 m
40 Ben Hardy 11.25 m
41 Aaron Harrison 11.50 m
42 David Palmer 11.75 m
43 Christopher Simpson 11.75 m
44 Paul Taylor 11.75 m
45 Ben Wright 11.75 m
46 Daniel Flesfadar 12.00 m
47 Nathan Hoare 12.00 m
48 David Miller 12.00 m
49 Brad Schutz 12.00 m
50 Rafal Staporski 12.00 m
51 David Girolamo 12.50 m
52 Tyson Hancock 12.75 m
53 Luke Buchanan 13.00 m
54 Shaun Ryder 13.50 m
55 Clint Tobin 13.50 m
56 Shane Grimwade 15.75 m
57 Anthony Fedele 16.00 m
58 Kim Staporski 18.00 m



MORT DALY RUNNING FOUNDATION 120m Under 20
1 Sebastian Baird 0.00 m
2 Corey Baker 3.75 m
3 Tjimarri Sanderson-Milera 4.50 m
4 Deng Bulabek 5.75 m
5 Ryan McCarthy 6.00 m
6 Sam Osmond 6.25 m
7 Samuel Gill 7.00 m
8 Bailey Sadedin 7.00 m
9 Jonathon Sinclair 7.00 m
10 Matthew Sinclair 7.75 m
11 Valentino Yuel 8.00 m
12 Oliver Callahan 8.50 m
13 Lewis Warland 8.50 m
14 Lachlan Sheffield 9.00 m
15 Connor Verrall 9.00 m
16 Liam Wright 9.25 m
17 Jack Hannah 10.00 m
18 Lincoln Hill 10.00 m
19 Bradley Jolly 10.00 m
20 Lewis Abdul 10.50 m
21 Joshua Biggs 11.00 m
22 Zac Gregson 11.50 m
23 Jess Rafanelli 12.00 m
24 Liam Rickard 12.00 m
25 Joshua Stangroome 12.00 m
26 Max Stevens 12.00 m
27 Jack Sutton 12.00 m
28 Bray Rafanelli 12.25 m
29 Sam O'Grady 12.50 m
30 Ryan Atkins 13.00 m
31 Tim Earle 14.00 m
32 Jakson Messent 14.75 m
33 Lucy Mayo 15.00 m
34 Lily Micklethwait 15.00 m
35 Bradley Harvey 15.50 m
36 Hayley Orman 16.00 m
37 Corey Watkins 16.00 m
38 Tom O Malley 18.00 m
39 Mikayla Round 18.00 m
40 Katie Devlin 19.00 m
41 Jessica Macolino 20.00 m
42 Billie Ninham-Smith 20.00 m
43 Lily Drummond 22.00 m
44 Briana Heinjus 22.00 m
45 Jazmin McShane 23.00 m
46 Ellie Meich 23.00 m
47 Natasha Inglis 23.25 m
48 Taylah Scapens 23.25 m
49 Kyla Brown 24.00 m
50 Rachel Fisk 24.00 m
51 Katie Jury 24.00 m
52 Kate Monks 24.50 m
53 Georgia Hext 25.00 m
54 Sarah Donovan 25.50 m
55 Hollie Moran 25.50 m
56 Tayce Fry 26.00 m
57 Margaret Cusenza 26.50 m
58 Madeline Nicholson 27.00 m
59 Jenni Partington 27.00 m
60 Patricia Dimitrak 32.00 m



Messenger 120m Over 45
1 David Brenen 8.50 m
2 graham harris 8.50 m
3 Andrew Buttery 8.75 m
4 Peter Biggs 10.25 m
5 Steve Butler 13.50 m
6 Michael Cassidy 13.75 m
7 Mark Donovan 16.00 m
8 John Turner 16.25 m
9 Alex Jefferies 17.25 m
10 Chris Dimitrak 18.00 m
11 Ross Hill-Brown 19.50 m
12 Bronwynn Kemp 20.00 m
13 Brett Stokes 20.75 m
14 Eugene DeVizio 21.00 m
15 Ray Earle 25.50 m
16 Ron Axford 26.00 m
17 Jackie Chehade 26.00 m
18 Darcy Cheney 26.00 m
19 Gary Ferber 26.00 m
20 Sue Turner 26.25 m
21 Lyn Peake 32.75 m
22 Brian Hart 37.00 m



MORT DALY RUNNING FOUNDATION 550m Open
1 Robert Killmier 24.00 m
2 Matthew Axford 26.00 m
3 Josh Dawkins 26.00 m
4 Robert Kane 26.00 m
5 Brian Golden 30.00 m
6 Kostya Khudoshin 30.00 m
7 Damian Robinson 32.00 m
8 Christopher Simpson 32.00 m
9 Jordan Harvey 34.00 m
10 Leif Christensen 36.00 m
11 Michael Nitschke 38.00 m
12 Matthew Sinclair 38.00 m
13 Stephen Alexander 40.00 m
14 Stephen Jelfs 40.00 m
15 Connor McIvor 40.00 m
16 Christopher Ross 40.00 m
17 James Ralston 42.00 m
18 Ashley Brown 44.00 m
19 Sam Royans 44.00 m
20 Ben Wright 44.00 m
21 Ben Crawford 45.00 m
22 Dane Fenton 45.00 m
23 Nicholas Giles 45.00 m
24 Jarrad Dartnall 48.00 m
25 Riordan Welsh 48.00 m
26 Amin Chehade 50.00 m
27 Matthew Cousins 50.00 m
28 Matthew Fallon 50.00 m
29 Jake Stangewitz 50.00 m
30 David Palmer 52.00 m
31 David Girolamo 54.00 m
32 Mark Beveridge 56.00 m
33 Aaron Jelfs 56.00 m
34 Brad Schutz 65.00 m
35 Simon Thompson 66.00 m
36 Matthew Zacher 66.00 m
37 James Grant 68.00 m
38 Brad Jones 68.00 m
39 Richard McMahon 70.00 m
40 Geoff Troiano 76.00 m
41 Luke Stewart 94.00 m



MORT DALY RUNNING FOUNDATION 550m Women
1 Caitlin Stanley 28.00 m
2 Bridgid Connolly 30.00 m
3 Chantel Seaforth 34.00 m
4 Kim Staporski 34.00 m
5 Teagan Kustermann 42.00 m
6 Hettie Driscoll 44.00 m
7 Demi Axford 50.00 m
8 Katherine Robb 50.00 m
9 Jane Mudge 52.00 m
10 Emily Hyde 62.00 m
11 Jenni Partington 65.00 m
12 Amy Robb 66.00 m
13 Megan Letton 68.00 m
14 Rommi Driscoll 72.00 m
15 Paige Bateman 76.00 m
16 Yasmin Openshaw 78.00 m
17 Isabella Partington 82.00 m
18 Lauren McHugh 86.00 m
19 Lisa Roberts 86.00 m
20 Tess Fraser 92.00 m
21 Courtney Ryder 102.00 m
22 Anthea Kotyla 112.00 m
23 Debbie DeVizio 120.00 m
24 Cheryl Zeuner 136.00 m



MORT DALY RUNNING FOUNDATION 550m Over 35
1 Brian Golden 10.00 m
2 Amin Chehade 18.00 m
3 Andrew Buttery 34.00 m
4 graham harris 34.00 m
5 Nathan Hoare 34.00 m
6 Salvador Jurado 34.00 m
7 Steven Wilson 34.00 m
8 George Diakomichalis 40.00 m
9 Ali Saliu 40.00 m
10 Rafal Staporski 44.00 m
11 Steve Butler 46.00 m
12 David Miller 46.00 m
13 Brett Stokes 48.00 m
14 Geoff Troiano 50.00 m
15 Richard Everson 52.00 m
16 Trudy Schrapel 54.00 m
17 Gregor Dingwall 56.00 m
18 Brendan Golden 56.00 m
19 Anthony Booth 58.00 m
20 Grant Oates 58.00 m
21 Mark Worthing 60.00 m
22 Mick Abbott 74.00 m
23 Daniel Tregenza 74.00 m
24 Chris Dimitrak 75.00 m
25 Ron Axford 90.00 m
26 Mark Barnett 90.00 m
27 John Turner 90.00 m
28 Eugene DeVizio 93.00 m
29 Ray Earle 94.00 m
30 Darcy Cheney 110.00 m
31 Ian Reddaway 112.00 m
32 Mark Howson 122.00 m
33 Brian Witty 126.00 m
34 Debbie DeVizio 136.00 m
35 John Hewton 136.00 m
36 Cheryl Zeuner 150.00 m



SA ATHLETIC LEAGUE 550m Under 14
1 Ryan Mayes 30.00 m
2 Lachie Moran 30.00 m
3 Lachlan Burrows 35.00 m
4 Marshall Harvey 35.00 m
5 Kyle Roberts 40.00 m
6 Alex Martini 52.00 m
7 Sarah Chigwidden 57.00 m
8 Fern Davies 60.00 m
9 Briana Heinjus 60.00 m
10 Natassia Messent 60.00 m
11 Tayla Oates 60.00 m
12 Minnie Turner 86.00 m
13 Saxon Turner 86.00 m



MORT DALY RUNNING FOUNDATION 550m Under 20
1 Max Stevens 28.00 m
2 Sam Russell 30.00 m
3 Jack Sutton 30.00 m
4 Scott Hargreaves 32.00 m
5 Tim Earle 35.00 m
6 Hayden Rothe 35.00 m
7 Connor McIvor 36.00 m
8 Riley Bonner 40.00 m
9 Murlin Every 40.00 m
10 Tom Lancaster 40.00 m
11 Hayden Mayes 40.00 m
12 Aiden Miller 40.00 m
13 Aidan Norbury 40.00 m
14 Corey Watkins 45.00 m
15 Jacobi Ponury 50.00 m
16 Ben Sieben 58.00 m
17 Lachlan Hocking 60.00 m
18 Emily Young 64.00 m
19 Ellie Meich 76.00 m
20 Patricia Dimitrak 95.00 m
21 Isabella Partington 95.00 m



MORT DALY RUNNING FOUNDATION 1600m Open
1 Robert Killmier 75.00 m
2 James Ralston 100.00 m
3 Michael Nitschke 110.00 m
4 Leif Christensen 120.00 m
5 Shane Thiele 120.00 m
6 Max Stevens 130.00 m
7 Ben Crawford 135.00 m
8 Jordan Harvey 140.00 m
9 Dane Fenton 145.00 m
10 Stephen Jelfs 145.00 m
11 Damian Robinson 150.00 m
12 Shane Rubino 150.00 m
13 Matthew Konetschka 160.00 m
14 Matthew Fallon 170.00 m
15 Christopher Ross 175.00 m
16 Geoff Troiano 230.00 m
17 Adam Cleary 240.00 m
18 Richard McMahon 240.00 m
19 Gregor Dingwall 250.00 m
20 Melissa Lloyd 250.00 m
21 James Grant 265.00 m
22 Gaetano Aiello 340.00 m



MORT DALY RUNNING FOUNDATION 1600m Women
1 Tasmin McMahon 80.00 m
2 Melissa Lloyd 100.00 m
3 Nadia De Bellis 140.00 m
4 Jane Mudge 150.00 m
5 Lauren McHugh 240.00 m
6 Lisa Roberts 260.00 m
7 Isabella Partington 290.00 m
8 Courtney Ryder 310.00 m

http://protrack.easyforumlive.com

2 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Thu Dec 06, 2012 5:39 pm

JB


ProTrack Star
ProTrack Star
Interesting comparing this years marks to last years (http://protrack.easyforumlive.com/t1417-pre-bay-colley-reserve-handicaps?highlight=Bay+handicaps)

Youngy, has AWD won anything since Pre-Bay last year? Just a little confusing that Leon would pull her a metre when she didn't do too much last year.

Also, who is handicapping the 550m now- Leon or Zeuner?

It is interesting to see the 2-4m changes in the 550m with some being maybe a tad lucky and some not so lucky with the drifting marks.

3 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Thu Dec 06, 2012 9:10 pm

Whispers


ProTrack Star
ProTrack Star
AWD won the Bay 70m which would explain the penalty.

4 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Thu Dec 06, 2012 9:21 pm

Whispers


ProTrack Star
ProTrack Star
Forgot she also won Pre Bay 70m and because Dec is penalty free AWD remained on 1.50 for the Bay 70m.
Because of those two wins she was going to be hit hard when she next entered a 70m.
Hope this helps JB

5 PROGRAM OF EVENTS on Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:33 pm

Stokesy

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ProTrack A Grader
ProTrack A Grader
MDRF PRE BAY SHEFFIELD GIFT CARNIVAL

PROGRAM OF EVENTS 2012

TIME EVENT

12:00pm 70m Open heats (7 heats)
12:28pm 70m Under 17 heats (7 heats)
12:56pm 70m Women heats (5 heats)

1:16pm 120m Open heats (7 heats)
1:44pm 120m Over 45 heats (3 heats)

1:56pm OFFICIAL BREAK (12 mins)

2:08pm 120m Under 20heats (7 heats)
2:36pm 120m Over 45 final

2:46pm 1600m Women final

2:56pm 70m Open semis (2 semis)
3:04pm 70m Under 17 semis (2 semis)
3:12pm 70m Women semis (2 semis)

3:20pm 550m Over 35 heats (3 heats)

3:32pm 70m Open final
3:42pm 70m Under 17 final
3:52pm 70m Women final

4:02pm 1600m Open final

4:12pm OFFICIAL BREAK – SHADE ALLOCATION (12 mins)

4:24pm 120m Under 20 semis (2 semis)
4:32pm 120m Open semis (2 semis)

4:40pm 550m Women heats (3 heats)
4:52pm 550m Under 20 heats (2 heats)
5:00pm 550m Open heats (3 heats)

5:12pm 120m Under 20 final
5:22pm 120m Open final

5:32pm 550m Under 14 final
5:42pm 550m Over 35 final
5:52pm 550m Women final
6:02pm 550m Under 20 final
6:12pm 550m Open final

6 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:53 am

S.hill


JB wrote:Interesting comparing this years marks to last years (http://protrack.easyforumlive.com/t1417-pre-bay-colley-reserve-handicaps?highlight=Bay+handicaps)

Youngy, has AWD won anything since Pre-Bay last year? Just a little confusing that Leon would pull her a metre when she didn't do too much last year.

Also, who is handicapping the 550m now- Leon or Zeuner?

It is interesting to see the 2-4m changes in the 550m with some being maybe a tad lucky and some not so lucky with the drifting marks.


JB
Gary zeuner is doing the 550m now.
Does anyone know about interstate wins Effecting your home state handicaps?
For example
Simon Thompson recently won in Victoria off 62
Has 66 here?
Surely his win off 62 in victoria would come into play ?

7 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:12 am

Ribera

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Expert
Expert
Traditionally middle distance runners from Vic have needed more than their Vic handicap to be competetive in SA where the handicaps are out a bit. Likewise when SA runners come to Vic they go back a bit and generally are very competetive.
It was great to see Simon have some success and also great to see he has not been savaged in the handicaps. On the flip side I hope the Vics who were beaten by him, at leats meet him on even terms. ie/ if he goes up 4m from Vic handicap (including win), hopefully the Vics go up 4m at least.

8 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:37 am

youngy

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Admin
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Whispers wrote:Forgot she also won Pre Bay 70m and because Dec is penalty free AWD remained on 1.50 for the Bay 70m.
Because of those two wins she was going to be hit hard when she next entered a 70m.
Hope this helps JB


Well answered Whispers.

0.50m in a 70m is fair & reasonable mark given her 70m wins at Pre-Bay & the Bay. It looks tough but she did make the final on Sunday in her first start for the year, so it validates the mark. Doubt Alicia can win off it in the near future but the challenge is to find the form to be capable of winning off the mark so she can eventually run off scratch........Then - to win off scratch in a women's 70m would be something to strive for.


_________________
"Let's Go While We're Young"

9 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Fri Dec 07, 2012 12:48 pm

hillbilly


Interesting to see Saliu taken out of the handicap list!
Beard, bubner, Cibich for the gift.

10 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Fri Dec 07, 2012 1:05 pm

JH

avatar
Expert
Expert
Interesting to see Saliu taken out of the handicap list!


There was movement at the station for the word had passed around.............

11 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Fri Dec 07, 2012 1:21 pm

Trackstar

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Moderator
Moderator
JH wrote:Interesting to see Saliu taken out of the handicap list!


There was movement at the station for the word had passed around.............


Try finishin it for ya JH!

There was movement at the station, for the word had passed around
That the colt from the starters gun was slow away,
He took off like a wild horse – midway down the track,
So all the stewards had gathered to the fray.
All the tried and noted punters from the stations near and far
Had told the colt he had to change his way,
For the punters love hard racing where the wild bush horses are,
But the stewards had enough – so its a holi-day!

12 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Fri Dec 07, 2012 2:00 pm

hillbilly


Clever! Whose your picks?
Ive missed the polls.

13 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Fri Dec 07, 2012 2:14 pm

Rookie


Going on his whyalla form if coots is to make the trip I think he should win.
Can't count out hicks with his scintillating form this season and I'm also going to throw brad schutz name into it.
First run last week and looked good in the 70 hopefully see him over the gift this week.

550 will be the choice race with a lot of big ins for the warm up.
Royans last years winner off the same mark will be tough to beat but Simon Thompson is my pick after a couple of good wins in vic off a tighter mark.
Throw in khudoshin for his first run this season and the always reliable beveridge it's going to be a hell of a final to see who is moving well!!

14 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:53 pm

Guest

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Guest
Interesting how the Vic's move up in SA and the SA runners move back in Vic, yes that old chestnut. Anyone have any recent lists of success of SA wins in Vic v's Vic wins in SA narrowed down to Stawel and the Bay?

15 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Tue Dec 11, 2012 8:04 am

Ribera

avatar
Expert
Expert
I'm not sure how relevant the Bay to Stawell comparison is? A lot of Sth Aussies have had enough by Stawell as they were more than likely peaking for Bay. The only fair comparsion would be to compare the SA big ones such as Mt Gambier, Bay, Camden and Loxton versus Maryborough, Ballarat, Keilor, Bendigo and Stawell.

Last year Vics had 2 winners at Bay Sheff and SA had 2 winners at Stawell.
Last season Roberts won Maryborough 300 womens, Letton Maryborough 120m womens off 13.50m then wins Loxton 120 womens off 14.25m, Girolamo won Ringwood $3500 gift and Beveridge won Ballarat $1500 800m. Bendigo no SA winners (hardly any entries).
In Sth Aust, Hipworth won Loxton o/35s 1000m (then won open 550m in Vic the next day), Chris Hargreaves 70m Mt Gambier. Camden no wins.

The previous season the Vics probably won more in SA. The point it is fairly even the amount of wins SA versus Vic. The Vics then get regular raids from Tas, NSW and QLD which SA don't get quite as much of.

The point is the handicaps are tighter in Vic and that is why Thomson needs more in the 550m in SA. His 4th on the weekend shows this parity.
Hopefully the Vics do not meet him on worse handicap terms at The Bay Sheff than they met him at Epping. EG/ if he goes up 4m then the Vics go up at least 4m.

16 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Tue Dec 11, 2012 9:37 am

S.hill


Thompson ran 4th off 62, does not need 66
He won his heat comfortably just struggled with the short break and it being his 5th run for the day
Come bay time with a 2-3 hour break he will be up to his neck in it

17 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:19 am

Ribera

avatar
Expert
Expert
Yes 62m, the same as his Vic winning handicap. That means without the Vic win he would have had around 66m (if you call his win the standard 3-4m pull). If the Vics don't go up 4m they are at a disadvantage.
My original point was to defend Simon, saying his handicap was fair and equitable. However, O/35er delved the discussion a little further in answer to my suggestion that Vic middle distance runners needed more in SA than their Vic handicap.
In the 800m Crawford won 2011 Keilor $1200 800m off 62m. He now runs off 50m in Vic which I think is a little tight but did win $800. His SA handicap at Whyalla was 68m.
Beveridge won 2012 Ballarat 800m ($1500 race?) off 64m. He ran Whyalla off 90m.
Shultz wins Camden off 40m. Comes back to 34m and wins Stawell. 1. Camden is more than a 6m pull. 2. He needed to be pulled off his Vic handicap and not his inflated SA handicap.
If the Vics run off their current Vic handicaps they are gone before the race commences.

ps. There are probably examples also where Vics have been given too much, such as when Lynch won the frontmarkers 1600m.

18 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Tue Dec 11, 2012 12:07 pm

vicinsider


Ribera, you are a great asset for protrack, it's the great insight and form analysis which makes your information a must read.

With yourself and youngy providing form and analysis constantly it's a joy to read.

Keep up the good work, and more importantly keep on sticking up for the Vics!!!!!

19 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:42 pm

Whispers


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You also mentioned Roberts and Girolamo .
Roberts won Stawell off 124m but runs off 85 in SA.
Girolamo won Ringwood off 50m ,runs off 36 in SA
So interestingly these two athletes marks go complete opposite way to the others.
So if any athlete thinks they are hard done by perhaps they arent too bad after all.

20 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:45 pm

Ribera

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Bottom line - take your chances when they present.

21 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:16 pm

Trackstar

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You said it Ribera!

I remember Lisa Roberts looking heavy/out of peak shape when she was going around 2 years ago. Much leaner and fitter at Stawell. Got a vg mark 124 and took her chances. 85 is competitive going on Stawell run.

Girolamo got under the guard. Proved to be vg mark that 50 at Ringwood - 45.87.
What I've seen No 400's in SA go anywhere near <47. 35 is fair.

Good on em for taking their chances when they presented.

22 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:41 pm

Whispers


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Dont forget Trackstar that Ringwood is a tartan track so times for the 400m probably shouldnt be compared to some of the other tracks,
Girolamos time compares pretty similar to what gets run in the Ringwood Gift , wouldnt say it was a standout.
46.27
46.04
47.62
45.54
are some of the most recent.
Interesting that Girolamo runs off 43 in Vic even AFTER his Ringwood win , just strange that theres such a difference in the marks between Vic and SA considering he hasnt won a sash in SA.
On this basis I will have to disagree that the 35 is fair.

23 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Wed Dec 12, 2012 6:54 am

Ribera

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The reason Roberts/Girolamo were brought up was not to compare their SA/VIC handicaps. It was simply to answer O/35ers question about who's won what. They are in events I did not analyse plus Girolamo is not competetive in SA 400's so his SA handicap is irrelevant.
My original point pertained only to middle distance / distance handicaps and the 2 boys mentioned are competetive in both states so have relevance.

BTW, mentioning Crawford and Beveridge is for example purposes only. Nothing personal on them as they are both cracking fellas as well as 2 of the best pro racers in Aus.

24 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Wed Dec 12, 2012 10:20 pm

Guest

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Thanks for everyones input, the thread certainly gained momentum. Am I wrong in showing concern for the coming Bay Sheffield meet where if as an example Lisa Roberts runs off 124 in Vic and wins where in SA in the same distance her mark is 85, if a Vic runner comes over and runs off say 62 in the Vic comp comes over and competes at the Bay with an expected lift out to say 66 doesnt that go against the grain? or is this just one of not many likely scenarios?

25 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Thu Dec 13, 2012 7:20 am

Ribera

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There will always be one off anomolies in this sport, however I reckon your way off the mark on this one.
Lisa, before her Stawell 800m womens win, was on 85m in a womens 550m in SA and 160m in a womens 1000m in SA. So her 124m 800m handicap in Vic had parity to these handicaps at the time. She just put in a bloody good winter and reaped the rewards.
Your example is also in a not regular event.
I've already given examples of athletes who are competetive in both states, Beveridge and Crawford. If the Vics stay on their Vic handicaps they meet these winners worse off.

On the flip side, sometimes a Vic is thrown in because something has been missed. An example is last year in the 800m. A Vic runner who has around 40m in his home state was thrown 58m for a first time Bay entry. He had also just run 1.55 in amateur comp. He didn't win the final because he didn't back up but it was very unfair on Vics who come to the bay every year and meet someone from their own state worse off. It also didn't matter because a kid won it off 110m !!

26 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Thu Dec 13, 2012 7:30 am

Ribera

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After looking at the Brighton handicaps I see another example.
Schutz won Stawell 400m off 34m and has 34m at Brighton. Any Vic who doesn't go up in handicap for Camden, is meeting the Stawell winner worse off.

This is not criticism of the handicapping or the athlete, just simply laying out the facts.

27 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Thu Dec 13, 2012 7:54 am

Whispers


ProTrack Star
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For as long as we have handicap running we will all wonder at times how some runners get certain handicaps.
Agree with you Ribera ,Shultz can consider himself pretty lucky ,winning Camden and Stawell and only going back 6m

28 Re: PRE-BAY Handicaps on Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:09 am

MOB

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This has been an interesting and reasonable discussion on a topic that can get a bit heated at times.

In the main, SAAL handicaps are generally in excess of their VAL equivalents, however as has been shown, there are exeptions.

Lisa Roberts and David Girolama are not good examples as their VAL marks were the result of regularly competing in the VAL over a number of seasons whilst they were residing in Melbourne. Whilst their lesser SA marks were probably reflective of having done very few recent SAAL comps prior to last season. So in effect last season they were VAL handicapped athletes competing in the SAAL. They were certainly worthy winners here after working hard and making great improvements. A measure of their dedication was after they moved to SA in the middle of the 2011 winter, they continued to travel to Melbourne on a weekly basis to complete their VCCL winter season.

The aim of the handicappers is always to make interstate athletes who regularly travel, competitive, subject to their form. Generally speaking I think both leagues do a good job of this. (Thank goodness it is someone else's job now).

The likes of Crawford, Beveridge and Thompson are far more relevant examples as they are consistent SAAL athletes and regularly compete in the VAL. The fact they have all enjoyed success in the VAL is deserved and testament to their efforts.

I'm looking forward to attending Bay again this year. All the best to those competing.

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